Melanie Wilson (00:01.742)
I am so excited, Megan and Stephanie, to discuss our topic for today. But before we dive into that, I would love to have both of you tell us more about yourselves and your family. Stephanie, in your case, what you have been up to since we spoke last.

Meghan Voss (00:18.772)
you

Stefanie Hohl (00:20.834)
Yeah, so since we spoke last, the biggest thing I did was I went to Oxford, England to speak at the World Literacy Summit. So that was a really cool experience. I met a lot of great people in the literacy world, so that was fabulous.

Meghan Voss (00:30.258)
So jealous.

Melanie Wilson (00:40.764)
Wow, I'm impressed.

Meghan Voss (00:44.948)
She sent lots of photos and I was there with her in my mind. I was there in person.

Melanie Wilson (00:49.392)
Yes. And Megan, what about you? Would you introduce yourself and your family to us?

Stefanie Hohl (00:49.454)
Yeah.

Meghan Voss (00:57.224)
Yeah, I'd love to. So my name is Megan Voss. I am an educator and yeah, I work in lots of different, I'm a former teacher, former public educator. I also have a little bit of homeschool experience, although I feel like I'm always learning from homeschoolers more than I have experience in knowing about it, but a lot of respect for the homeschooling community.

I currently work with a local nonprofit as an education manager and I loved partnering with Steph on this project. She's my sister and so that was a really fun thing to do together with her. Just me personally, I'm a mom of three and I live in Northwest Montana. I have no pets, like Steph always talks about her pets. I have no pets, but we do have occasional bears and you know.

Melanie Wilson (01:44.06)
Thanks.

Meghan Voss (01:51.144)
those kinds of animals in our backyard. I get, I feel like that counts.

Melanie Wilson (01:56.624)
think so. That's wonderful. So nice to meet you, Megan. Okay, so let's turn our attention to this topic. I am very, very excited about it. Every once in a while, it's actually been happening quite a bit for me lately. I wish that I could go back and homeschool my kids again because so many amazing...

ideas and resources come to my attention and yours is one of them. So we're going to talk about book clubs for homeschoolers in this case. What are the biggest benefits that you have seen for homeschoolers or really for any family who chooses to participate in a book club? Especially we're going to be talking about mothers and daughters participating together. I love it.

Stefanie Hohl (02:52.462)
Well, to me, the greatest benefit is that connection between moms and daughters. I think when you homeschool a lot of time, there's like, you know, that teacher role, the parent role. And with a mother-daughter book club, you can kind of have this shared experience of reading a book together and discussing it where you're not really in the teacher role. It's more of in like this.

shared community space and you can create these really amazing memories and have these good discussions and experiences. So to me, like that's some of my favorite memories with my kids is having these book clubs because I love books so much and I love sharing that with them. And it's just been a wonderful way to connect and experience literature together.

Meghan Voss (03:45.586)
And from a public edu- from an educator, I- I mean, I say public educator, but let's just say educator. From an educator perspective, I feel like there's so much emphasis on, you know, all the things that we need to learn. And especially coming from the public school domain where it's like we have these objectives, we have all of these different goals that we're supposed to meet. I was an English educator and what was really important to me, and I think this resonates a lot with the homeschool community, at least the friends of mine who are- who have homeschooled.

is this idea of having the kids have a voice in their education. so, you know, so much, you know, even when I was teaching in the public school, we'd talk about books, but I wanted to hear what, I didn't want to just tell them what it meant. I would say, you know, this is what we know. How does this make you feel? How does this apply to you personally? And then when they have a voice and then the parents have a voice, so I think it adds to that connection that Steph was talking about. And it really allows kids to

Melanie Wilson (04:29.733)
Mm-mm.

Meghan Voss (04:45.118)
have that autonomy and confidence that they have the capacity to understand literature. And it's not just a top-down, adults are going to tell me what to think about books, but rather, I can have my own thoughts about books, and that matters. And anyway, so I find that that's probably my favorite part of it, is to give them that autonomy.

Melanie Wilson (05:09.72)
Absolutely. And what about just book clubs in general? Stephanie, I'm going to go back to you. What are some of the other benefits besides giving students a voice and allowing them to really engage with the books and apart from a lecture kind of talking down approach, which I love that, Megan. So thank you for sharing that.

Are there some other benefits that you have found?

Stefanie Hohl (05:42.306)
Yeah, for sure.

Well, just reading books in general builds a lot of empathy in kids. And so being able to discuss people and situations that are different than you or your life just makes everyone's life richer and deeper. It helps you understand people and situations. And then the social aspect of it, like being able to discuss thoughts with.

other kids and other parents and you know maybe you agree about some things and maybe you disagree and that's okay and having like this safe space to explore some of those ideas. I also have found it's a great place to read books that might stretch your child a little bit. I'm a firm believer in letting your child choose what they want to read but I would use book club as an opportunity.

to maybe present something that they wouldn't normally pick up on their own because we'd be reading it together. So it's not always as intimidating to them if it's a little bit harder for them or just something, a topic maybe they're not interested in. So I think it allows a much wider variety of books to be read. so it just, it broadens their horizons. It develops their critical thinking.

It builds these relationships with other people in the community. So yeah.

Meghan Voss (07:09.396)
and I'm just gonna jump in here and just say, it makes it fun too. think there's also the element of struggling readers where we did a book club with some local friends and one of the friends that came, she doesn't read well and she doesn't really enjoy reading per se. I don't like to say she doesn't read well. She struggles with reading. It's just a struggle for her.

Stefanie Hohl (07:12.802)
Hmm. Yeah, I forgot that.

Meghan Voss (07:37.842)
And I remember her mom coming up to me afterwards and we had this fun and she didn't worry about having her daughter read the book or anything, but we had such a fun time at the book club, you know, book party, the book club event that her mom said, my goodness, like we can listen to these books together. And then her daughter can still have this positive experience with literature so that it doesn't become this thing like that's not what I do.

but rather I still love literature even if I struggle with it. And I think that kind of builds that resilience in kids to be able to realize that hard things can still be fun and vice versa.

Stefanie Hohl (08:16.206)
Well, and I think that a lot of parents stop reading out loud to their kids once they can read on their own, which is really quite sad. And when you have this parent-child book club, it gives you that incentive to continue reading with your child. Like that's often why I kept reading to my kids. It's like, we have book club. We got to read this book together. And so then we would get it done and we would make it a priority.

Whereas I think often once a child can read on their own, it's really easy for parents to say, just go read your book before bed. know, which, you know, there's a lot of research that shows that when you continue reading to your children, it has a lot of benefits.

Melanie Wilson (09:00.108)
Mm-hmm. Excellent. I just love that you added those benefits because I think it would be kind of a knee-jerk reaction to think, well, my child is dyslexic, for example, so there's no way that my child could participate in a book club. But with the audio books that we have available to us now, there's really no reason that you couldn't do it. Or as Stephanie, as you are suggesting,

it could be a book that you read aloud with your child or even as a family if you want to include everyone in it. One of my favorite things that I did as a homeschooling mom was to read aloud with all of my kids. just fantastic suggestions. And I was thinking to kind of adding to what you were talking about, Megan, that

It would be another great opportunity for kids to develop their social skills. I have been all about that lately, helping kids develop social and emotional skills. Reading is wonderful to help kids learn about how to manage their emotions, but it is a great place to practice on your social skills when you're having a book discussion. So it's just a fantastic.

endeavor, I think, to begin. now we turn to, okay, I want to do it. You've sold me on this. Now, how do I go about choosing the books?

Stefanie Hohl (10:38.318)
That is a good question. So in our book club guide, we tried to be really careful about choosing a large variety of contemporary, realistic fiction, fantasy, historical fiction, to kind of give people an option of like, you know, whatever they like and love. But I, you know, I think looking at books that have won awards, books that are bestsellers, books where

Books that will provide a good discussion, that maybe delve into deeper topics or things that you can think about are always good choices, things like that. I think often kids, for instance, for one of my book clubs, we read Anna Green Gables and my daughter was not interested at first.

Melanie Wilson (11:34.01)
Okay.

Stefanie Hohl (11:34.784)
As soon as we started, like, got into it, then she was really into it. You so sometimes it takes a little bit for them to really, like, catch the vision. But, you know, just choosing those kinds of books, you know, you can do classics or new books that have made impact or, you know, things like that.

Meghan Voss (11:53.586)
And we tried to choose, and I like what Steph said about, you know, looking at books that have won awards, looking at books that, I mean, and honestly, sometimes it's, you know, which books are people talking about? And, and I feel like that leads to those critical thinking ideas. I mean, there are some very popular books that for me, I have a degree, my, undergraduate degree is in English. My graduate degree is in education, teaching English. And so sometimes I'd hear about this really popular book that came out.

And I would read it with a critical eye thinking, well, I'm going to show how this isn't great. And sometimes I'd read it and be like, yeah, it's really not that great. But then other times I'd read them and be like, actually, this deserves all the credit, right? And so again, it's not, know, some of these books we know are great. And then some of them maybe we don't know yet. And so we can kind of make that decision together, which again, is an exercise in itself. But we also tried to choose for our

Melanie Wilson (12:24.316)
you

Meghan Voss (12:47.07)
For the books that we chose, we tried to also choose books that were different formats. So we have everything from graphic novels, like nonfiction graphic novels, to storyline graphic novels, to a book in verse as well. so hopefully, that can kind of tap into just different ways of telling a story. Some of the stories are just very straightforward. And then other one, my daughter's favorite is called Where the Mountain Meets the Moon.

which is based on Chinese folklore. And, and so it kind of follows multiple, there's one main story, but there's like multiple small stories in between. so there's just lots of different ways to, see what you like. And in our guide, we tried to, we gave like a summary of each of the books. And then we also gave some ideas of like, what are some of the themes of this book and what are some of like these overarching ideas? so that you can.

at least look at it and just be like, okay, maybe this is for us or nah, this isn't our thing. And that's fine.

Melanie Wilson (13:46.908)
Okay, all right, well wonderful. Well, it sounds like you've really done some of the heavy lifting for parents who would like to start a book club. Some follow-up questions I have for you are, what ages of kids would you recommend participating in a book club?

Stefanie Hohl (14:07.906)
I mean, I always thought it was great to start around fourth grade, fourth, fifth grade. For all my kids, we did the book club from about fourth to eighth grade. After eighth grade, they weren't as, you know, once they're in high school, they weren't as into it. But actually, I also did some book clubs with younger kids, like kindergarten through third grade, which, you know, they looked a little bit different, but those were really fun too.

So I mean, honestly, any age. I know there's high schoolers that want to still have book clubs too, but maybe they don't want their parents there. I don't know. Yeah.

Melanie Wilson (14:39.27)
Mm-hmm. OK.

Meghan Voss (14:41.044)
Right. It might not be a mother-daughter one, depending. But we also tried to keep it, I mean, obviously you can do these with a group if you had a, if you have a co-op group or other families, but you can also do them one-on-one. If you just within your own family, if you just said, you know what, I want to, we want to read this book together and do some activities as a family. So it doesn't have to be a large group gathering. really, we really wanted to make it.

with the guide, you can do this any way you want, but especially within our guide, even we tried to make it so that it was very usable, user-friendly for any, for whatever works for you.

Melanie Wilson (15:20.636)
All right, so here's another follow-up question. If I decided that I wanted to do a book club with other families, how would you recommend going about deciding on a book? And by that, I mean, do you as the organizer choose a book? Do you and your child choose a book and then you tell the rest of the families, this is what we're doing, or do you vote or what?

What would you recommend?

Stefanie Hohl (15:51.234)
I mean, you can do it any way that works for your group. The way we did it, usually, whoever was hosting would choose the next book. But like my current book club I'm in for adults, we vote at the beginning of the year and choose all our books, which works great too. Like I have had some friends that feel kind of overwhelmed by picking a book.

Melanie Wilson (16:14.982)
Mm-hmm.

Stefanie Hohl (16:16.43)
So then I usually will send them three options and I'm like, these are all great, take a look and they pick one of those. So like if you have someone that's maybe more comfortable or more familiar with children's literature, you know, maybe they could make suggestions and then someone could choose from that list. So, you know, it's really just whatever works for your group and what they're interested in doing. Like I would suggest asking, like if you, you know, if you get five moms and daughters that are interested, I would say,

Do you guys want to each take turns picking books or do we want to vote on them and see what they want to do?

Melanie Wilson (16:50.076)
Excellent, excellent advice. Okay, so now let's turn to you have a book club, whether that's, as you said, mother, daughter, one-on-one, or you have multiple participants. How can a parent keep their kids engaged in the book discussions? And I feel like this is maybe another question, so if you wanna answer this separately, that's totally fine. But how do we help our kids think

critically about what they're reading.

Stefanie Hohl (17:23.054)
Come on, take this one first, Meg.

Meghan Voss (17:24.852)
Yes. So yeah, because I love critical thinking. just, I mean, I think part of it is really, I mean, as simple as asking as much as we can open ended questions, right? And so within the book, within our guide, when we came up with questions and stuff, we tried to include some that were book based and some that were just life based, that were based on themes of the book. But I think that in general, yeah, if you're asking those critical questions,

A lot of times it's asking why at the end of it. So did you agree with Anne's decision to dye her hair green or, know, with Anne of Green Gables or something? Is that something that you would have done? And then if a kid answers with, yes, I would have done that or no, I wouldn't have. It's just that simple follow up. Why or why not? And then, you know, I think that just gets kids thinking a little bit. Anytime I think you can

create that connection. also helps. There's actually, it's funny because this wasn't even in our guide, but it's a question we came up with just within our group when we were doing where the mountain meets the moon and the main character has a name that is meaningful. And so we just went around and we had the moms all tell like, where did you come up with your child's name? What was that story? And

And then, or we'd ask the kids like, do you know where your name came from? And some of them knew and some of them didn't. And it was really this beautiful moment between them where the kids were really engaged. Cause I mean, this is about me and, the moms were engaged too. And so there was that connective element. but yeah, I, mean, it's such a simple thing, but just a follow-up question, especially if it's a yes or no answer, almost always will engage that critical.

thinking because a lot of times kids aren't used to the follow up. you know, you ask the question and they give the answer and you're like, good job. But being able to say, why do you feel that way? Or, you know, what made you think that it just sometimes catches them by surprise. you're like, I don't know. And then you can, and then if they're struggling with it, be like, well, let's talk about it. Was it maybe this or this or, you know,

Melanie Wilson (19:23.772)
You

Meghan Voss (19:41.748)
Anyway, but that's probably my best advice with regards to that stuff. Do you have anything to add to that?

Stefanie Hohl (19:47.214)
Well, I will speak to how to keep them engaged in the critical discussion. With girls, it wasn't that hard. I felt like they were usually into it. The boys were a little trickier. And I usually found what worked best would be to have the discussion while eating the snacks. Because that just gave them something to be physically doing and it kept them at the table.

Meghan Voss (19:50.249)
Yeah.

Melanie Wilson (20:08.247)
Hahaha

Stefanie Hohl (20:16.512)
and it kept them more engaged. So if you are struggling with keeping the conversation, the kids engaged in the conversation, try doing it while you're having the delicious and yummy snacks.

Meghan Voss (20:30.14)
And keep in mind that your group, you know, I mean, just kind of watch the group. If you ask like two questions and then kids are getting squirmy, then go do the activity or go ahead or like I said, you know, and enjoy the snack while you're talking about stuff or whatever it is. I mean, it doesn't have to be a super in-depth conversation for it to be a successful conversation. Even just showing up in the name of books is to me a success and

In a sense, that's critical thinking, right? I mean, if you're doing an activity that's doing an art project or a tea party or something that's engaged with a book, that's critically engaging with a book in a way that's outside of just what does this mean and who is this character? And so it doesn't always have to be talking that gets you to that next level.

Stefanie Hohl (21:24.814)
Well, and I'm all about making it fun and playful and moving and movement. And so even talking about the questions while doing an activity like Meg said is huge too, because they can be working on an art project or building something or whatever. And often while their hands are busy, their brain can still be focusing on the discussion.

Meghan Voss (21:28.532)
Steph is the queen of fun.

Melanie Wilson (21:46.254)
I recently came across the idea of having walking book discussions and my family and I were big into hiking and I just thought all the literature classes that I had with predominantly boys, most of the time it was only boys and I just thought, I missed that opportunity. That would have been amazing. You know, I can have some notes, some questions in front of me, but we could have been out there walking, hiking.

enjoying the outdoors while discussing books. So I will just add that as something I would do. That's great.

Stefanie Hohl (22:20.034)
I love that idea. Yeah, I love that idea.

Meghan Voss (22:21.938)
I love that idea so much. like in my mind, you know, I live in Montana, so we're always outside. So I'm like, how can I incorporate that this summer? I love that.

Melanie Wilson (22:30.236)
Yes, yes, I love it. Okay, so can you each share some of your favorite book club activities or ideas that have made the experience memorable for kids?

Stefanie Hohl (22:46.67)
Sure, do you go first?

Meghan Voss (22:49.076)
Sure, for my daughter, she's an art person. So with her, it's about incorporating art and making something beautiful out of it. so I would say that was very memorable because then she could bring the item home. And she also was able to go with me. I mean, that's where the connection happened too, right? Because we were able to. I am not a crafty person, but my daughter loves this kind of thing. And so even just going to the art.

like the craft store and picking out what are the items that you want to do to create this art piece that, everyone's going to do their own art piece was really fun for her and fun for us and made just, and it was so fun to see how each child's art piece that was about the book was a little bit different. And that was a really cool experience with her.

Melanie Wilson (23:45.148)
I love it.

Stefanie Hohl (23:46.254)
One of the most memorable things we did, is totally over the top, but for James and the giant peach, we sewed stuffed animal characters from the book, which was turned into a sewing lesson, but it was amazing. And then one for my boys that was much simpler was we read the crossover and we just went to a park and they played basketball, but they loved it.

Meghan Voss (23:50.782)
Yeah.

Melanie Wilson (23:52.325)
you

Meghan Voss (23:59.315)
my gosh.

Melanie Wilson (24:13.101)
Stefanie Hohl (24:14.082)
So, I mean, it can be something over the top or something super simple.

Melanie Wilson (24:18.48)
I love that. And when you're playing basketball or you're going on a hike, it doesn't require lots of prep time, right? So that's wonderful. Well, I just adore this topic and I really think that our listeners are going to be eating it up too. And I want them to be able to get a copy of your book, Mother Daughter Book Club Guide. So where is the best place for them to find it and to connect with

both of you online.

Stefanie Hohl (24:49.506)
Yeah, it's available on Amazon or on our website, abcseherdo.com. And they can connect on any social media at abcseherdo or at Stephanie Hull. And I'll let Megan tell you hers.

Meghan Voss (25:07.044)
Yeah, and you can go on Instagram to Megan Ross Studio. Stephs is the business side. Stephs is more of like the business marketing side. Mine is mostly pictures of Montana with a splash of business inside there. So but you're more than happy to I would love to have you connect with me in there as well.

Melanie Wilson (25:27.846)
Wonderful. And Stephanie, I know we did this last time you joined me, but can you spell out, make it really clear what the website is that ABCC here do? Okay.

Meghan Voss (25:37.268)
Yeah.

Stefanie Hohl (25:38.53)
Yes, so ABC, the letters ABC and then the word S-E-E and then H-E-A-R-D-O because we're all about seeing, hearing and doing.

Melanie Wilson (25:53.008)
Wonderful. That is just perfect. Well, this was a joy to talk with the two of you. I felt a little bit like I was on NPR, like the delicious dish or something, because I've got you too. And you're just very, you know, I don't know, you just kind of have that vibe for me. Okay, okay. Wonderful. But it was very much fun. So thank you so much for joining me.

Stefanie Hohl (26:13.646)
I'll take it.

Meghan Voss (26:14.748)
I know, I'm like, great.

Stefanie Hohl (26:21.528)
Thank you for having us.

Meghan Voss (26:21.79)
Thanks so much for having us.